Jump to content


Crown Macro Tech i Series

5000i 9000i 12000i Macro Tech

  • Please log in to reply
12 replies to this topic

#1 Outclear

Outclear
  • Members
  • 6 posts

Posted 06 May 2013 - 01:25 PM

Hi and good day to all...

First of all, I'm a new member to this forum, just trying to seek out some information on these amps.

I live in the caribbean [Trinidad & Tobago] to be exact, where we are flooded with the older model Macro Techs, but I'm trying to upgrade with the times.

I'm starting up my own little sound system i decided to go with these amps for a few reasons.

* Weight
* Power Output
* Brand [of course]

My subwoofers would either be :

4 single 18", 1000 - 1200 each wired down to 2ohms
or
2 dual 18", same as above.

I was thinking [hoping actually] that the 9000i would be perfect for running these subs on 1 channel @ 2ohms.

Any +ive / -ive feedback would be greatly appreciated.

P.S. i was also told that these amps would be better on Mid Range and Highs, rather than on Bass but I'm slightly confused that Crown would be making amps with all this power just for MIDS & HIGHS.

#2 dakos

dakos

    Admin

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 744 posts

Posted 08 May 2013 - 06:22 AM

Hello to you too and welcome to our little forum :)

A few things for you to consider:
1. What you saied about this amp not being for subs is completly wrong, this amp series and the i-Tech series absolutly shines when it comes to sub duty, someone must have confused the XTi series with this one or they could have misinterpeted some kind of technical review that had it's conclusions written vaiguly.

2. These amps have no problem runing at 2 ohm per channel all day long at maximum reliability, or at any impedance for that matter, I know quite a few SR techs that operate it at this mode with no problems for long periods of time.

Please post links to the subs you want to connect to this amp so I can double check it it fits this amp, also since this amp doesn't have an internal DSP, what kind of processing do you have?

If you have any more question just shoot...
Avi

#3 Outclear

Outclear
  • Members
  • 6 posts

Posted 08 May 2013 - 09:49 AM

Thanks for the response, i was begining to think i asked a dumb question and ppl were just not taking me on LOL

Well first of, I'm not going to be using any of the Factory JBL stuff as most people in here probably use.

Its going to be custom built subs [maybe the 728 or the VT 4880 design] Still not sure of the sub design

The Drivers are going to be RCF
http://www.rcf.it/pr...sducers/l18p300

Processing will be done via the DBX 260 Driverack, with external EQ 2231 and Compressor/Limiter/Gate 1066

In general i know its better to have more power than less power, so i was also thinking to run 2 18" per channel on the 5000i [2500Watts @ 4ohms]
and in the long run when the system grows i would go with the 2 dual 18" [4 drivers on a 2ohm load] with a bigger amp of course,
but then i may need the 12000i instead of the 9000i

#4 dakos

dakos

    Admin

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 744 posts

Posted 08 May 2013 - 02:16 PM

The 260 already has a limiter compressor, EQ and many more features so I suggest not to use all these devices as this will probably reduce sound quality.

If you like to build a cab yourself then that's great, I'm a big fan of DIY projects but I have to caution you that the end result will almost always be inferior to a box purchased for the same money made by a professional company (JBL, EV, Peavey and such).

You could just get a used itech 8000 if those are avilable at your reagion, almost the same power as the 12000i for much less money and far better DSP then the DR260.
Lots of good luck
Avi

#5 Outclear

Outclear
  • Members
  • 6 posts

Posted 08 May 2013 - 05:15 PM

I understand what you say about the 260, but seeing that im kinda new to the whole sound game, i would keep the analog components in case of any "spur of the moment" changes that i may have to make, like feedback issues and what not and i would probably turn them off on the DR260.

About the cab building, i wont be the one doing them, would be a professional builder who does it as his profession, and its actually a lot cheaper that way seeing that i would have to ship stuff overseas then pay TAX + DUTY on them.

I never thought about the i-techs because for some strange reason, i cant seem to like something that is pushing a lot of heat with a display [if you get what im saying] but im sure they have been under a lot of tests before being distributed so it will be something to consider.
I'll probably use the XTI2's for Mids & Highs though, just enough power for the smaller components.

Follow up questions :
* How stable are the XTI2's on the same 2 ohm load ? I would be having some head room on the amps [500 - 1000 watts]

* If I decided to go all out itechs for my entire system, there will be no use for a Driverack right ?

#6 dakos

dakos

    Admin

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 744 posts

Posted 08 May 2013 - 11:14 PM

I didn't understand the first question about the headroom... Headroom in a rig is something that we, as sound man, create, I explained it in this link:
http://www.crownaudi...st=0#entry16886
If I didn't understand your question and the link was useless then reask away.

All crown amps being sold nowadays are 2 ohm stable, you will hit the thermal limit of the amp sooner but usually that's not a problem.

About the all itech rig, then yes, the DR260 would be of no use as the DSP is of lower quality then the one on the itechs, HD or not.
Avi

#7 Outclear

Outclear
  • Members
  • 6 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 05:04 PM

I'm not sure of the exact wattage on the drivers for the mids and highs, so i stated that the amps would be used at 2ohms but they would be about 500 - 1000 watts more than the drivers, hence the use of the "headroom" wording.
Now i see its not really an issue since you pointed out that at 2ohms the newer model amps are stable.

But for now, I'd probably go with the MA i Series on the Subs with a DR260 [and save some cash] and use the XTI 2's on the mids and highs with the internal processing, and then later on, MAYBE switch out and get some i Tech HD's for the subs.

Thanks a whole lot for your help Dakos, all i need now is some classes on Driverack tuning and i'll be ok.

Thanks again for helping me to finally decide on what amps im gonna get.


YOU SHOULD BE PAID BY CROWN [ IF NOT ALREADY GETTING PAID LOL ]

#8 Outclear

Outclear
  • Members
  • 6 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 06:06 PM

Just a quick reference...

I've decided to go with the Crown MA 9000i which is [as listed] 4700 Watts @ 2ohms to power 8 of these...http://www.rcf.it/pr...sducers/l18p300 [4 x 1000 watts @ 2ohms]

There should be no problem there right ???

#9 joust

joust

    Power User

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 453 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 11:03 AM

Just food for thought: If I had a speaker rated at a 1000W (program), I would try to get an amp that can drive twice the rated (program) power, for headroom purposes. Since the speaker will sound fantastic at its full capacity, I would hate to have an amp that would start clipping (distort) at the rated (program) power; Hence twice the needed (program) power. :) (I'm not considering impedance at this point, just power.)
Also, use a correct AC source! These amps can operate on '15A' but may choke on so low amperage. Use a 20A AC source or better!
Furthermore, if you were to hear a terrible grinding, grounding, sound coming from the amp's power supply, use a higher amperage source: The amp is being choked, not enough current!

Alain

#10 dakos

dakos

    Admin

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 744 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 05:18 PM

Thank you for your compliments... and no, not earning from this.

The 9000i is a great amp but... the wattage rating you quoted is a 20mS burst, that's less of what a kick drum signal is so it's not that usefull spec, you should consider 2800W for any real world wattage calculation you do.

Second, I support Alain's recommendations for peak power, you should however not exceed the speakers continuous rating for too long so an external limiter is in order, the DR260 has a weird implementation of such a limiter but it can work.

Tha speakers you want to use have 500W continuous/RMS power and 2000W peak rating, RCF are switching the wattage rating names on purpase to confuse users into thinking they have more watts, some companies just do that even if their products are perfectly good.

Make sure you understand the concepts disscussed here and everything I wrote in the link a few posts up of this one before something goes seriously wrong.
Avi

#11 Outclear

Outclear
  • Members
  • 6 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 06:02 PM

Ok... I didn't want this post to be a long and drawn out one because I really hate to be the guy who frustrates everyone...so what i have gathered is listed below

* In any amp running at 2 ohms, use the [20Hz - 20Khz] or [1hz] ratings and not the [20 Ms burst] ratings

* The RCF L18P300 is rated 1000 W AES [Power Handling Capacity / 2000 W AES [Program/Continuous Power] but in reality is really 500 W RMS

* Make sure not to exceed speakers continuous ratings [which i knew], so its ok to run the same said drivers at e.g 1500 W but not more than 2000 W [correct me if I'm wrong]

The reason i choose these drivers, there is a friend i know who uses these drivers in some EAW 850 subs, and he powers 2 subs [4 speakers] with a Crown Macro Tech 5000VZ which is listed at 1800 W @ 4ohms per channel, and no problems whatsoever...

so after all the careful reading and knowledge gaining, i think i will just decide to go with the MA 5000i,
run the RCF drivers [2 8ohm = 4ohms, 2500 W as listed] instead of the 2ohm plan i was thinking about. :)

Thanks again !!!

#12 dakos

dakos

    Admin

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 744 posts

Posted 11 May 2013 - 05:01 AM

Ok, I'm happy you read what I wrote in the linked thread.

You can run this specific woofer at 500W continuously, no more then 500W !!! that's what the RMS/Continuous rating means, running continuously with no damage to the voice coil, as simple as that.
Us sound-man need to further limit the power fed to the speakers in order to avoid Power Compression so the actual continuous wattage is 125-250W, that's it !!!

I'll be happy to answer further questions :)

#13 joust

joust

    Power User

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 453 posts

Posted 13 May 2013 - 10:08 AM

Great demonstartion, Avi! B)

A.