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CE & XS Bridged for Subs


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#1 Bud Bolf

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 06:55 AM

Hello all,
I have a question to throw out.
The Band that I am in is going to be performing at an Outdoor Gig with another Band and I have a power question.
When setting up indoors I use a CE4000 on my two dual 15" sub cabs,
and an XS900 for my Monitor cabs.
However, at this outdoor gig the other band will bring their small PA (powered mixer and 2 yamaha 15" cabs) to cover the Monitor duty.
This frees up my XS900 and since it is outdoors, I thought of Bridging the CE4000
for one of my sub cab's and Bridging the XS900 for the other sub cab.

This will be a 120 Vac gig, so the CE4000 rates at 2800 (or is it 2400?) watts Bridged at 4 ohms and the XS900 is 2500 watts Bridged at 4 ohms, a difference of (100 or) 300 watts per side.
Should I pull back the CE4000 to match the XS900 Sub or not since it is outside?
How will these two amps compliment each other, and will there be a noticeable difference per Speaker stack?

On paper, power wise, the two amps do not look that far off, especially the way Subs suck up power.
Though on feature's and design the two Amps are very different, the XS900 has no Filter sets that the CE4000 has (though my DriveRack handles that) and then there is the basic amp design differences, like the BCA of the CE4000 that the XS900 does not have.

So, given all this, what do you think of my Scenario?
How should the Amps respond to each other in Bridged Sub duty.
Thanks,
    Bud

PS. My Sub cabs are loaded with two Eminence Omega 15's that are rated at 800 watts each, this gives the cab 1600 watts per, with the speakers parallelled and
so the 1.5x rating, would be 2400 watts, to it's 2x power rating of 3200 watts
per sub cab, so the 2500 to 2800 per cab Bridged should actually work out pretty good.

#2 DGlass

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 08:26 AM

Sonically they are pretty close but there is a difference in Damping. It so close, however, I would have to say for you to try it with your system to say if you could hear any difference. Cabling size, cabling length, the type of conections and source signal also come into play with a listening test. smile.gif

#3 Bud Bolf

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 09:01 AM

QUOTE(DGlass @ Nov 10 2005, 09:26 AM)
Sonically they are pretty close but there is a difference in Damping. It so close, however, I would have to say for you to try it with your system to say if you could hear any difference. Cabling size, cabling length, the type of conections and source signal also come into play with a listening test. smile.gif
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Thanks for the response David.
So given the cabling, which I do run 12/4 to my Subs and each speaker is wired independently (1+/1- and 2+/2-) which I then parallel the speakers (cab) at the amp via a rack panel and a wired Speakon chassis mount.
The amps should work fine and probably put out an un-noticeable hearing difference between cabs.
At least to the more common listener at an outdoor event.
I would also think that if it was noticeable at all, it would be more so, inside than out. I'll give it a go and let you know.

Provided that each amp is in the same operating range, (Wattage, Damping) is there a rule of thumb about mixing and matching Amps, either between different "lines" of a manufacturer's (CE,XS,XLS,MacroTech, etc..) and or amps between different manufacturer's.

Thanks again,
        Bud

#4 DGlass

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 09:53 AM

Two things,

#1  Make sure the amplifier input sensitivities are set the same. For example 1.4v.
Note: In 26 db mode the required voltage to obtain full output will vary from model to odel, Line to Line as it is a fixed gain position to obtain full output not a fixed voltage.

#2  Send a tone (of the proper frequency range) to the amps being setup to run together. Using the front panel input attenuator(s) match the output voltages using an AC volt meter. You can use Pink Noise for a full range box or on system using an electronic crossover by injecting the pink noise before the crossover. This way the speaker(s) are only receiving their band limited portion of the Pink Noise.

This will get you as close as you can in the field. smile.gif

#5 Bud Bolf

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 08:57 PM

QUOTE(DGlass @ Nov 10 2005, 10:53 AM)
Two things,

#1  Make sure the amplifier input sensitivities are set the same. For example 1.4v.
Note: In 26 db mode the required voltage to obtain full output will vary from model to odel, Line to Line as it is a fixed gain position to obtain full output not a fixed voltage.

#2  Send a tone (of the proper frequency range) to the amps being setup to run together. Using the front panel input attenuator(s) match the output voltages using an AC volt meter. You can use Pink Noise for a full range box or on system using an electronic crossover by injecting the pink noise before the crossover. This way the speaker(s) are only receiving their band limited portion of the Pink Noise.

This will get you as close as you can in the field. smile.gif
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Good Information.
    Thanks David,
            Bud